HoN General Strategy: Part 1 - Winning in the first 5 minutes.

[FiveS]

Considering a lot of the people on these forums are less familiar with some of the more important aspects of the game that can mean the difference between perennial badness and eventual aptitude, I have decided to make a series of guides which will outline in more detail the specific parts of what it takes to win a HoN game at a more competitive level. These guides (hopefully) will be very thorough depending on the response I get for the first one. As such, they will probably be a bit of a read. However, I have tried to make them interesting and engaging, so do have a read it should be worth it.

These guides will not teach you how to play a hero, they assume you already know how to play every hero with adequate aptitude.

DISCLAIMER:Please note that I am not claiming a monopoly on knowledge of HoN in the gotgames community as I am well aware that there are many accomplished players, a fair few of whom are better than me, I do welcome criticism and additions to my guides. All of these guides shall be completely nebulous in that I will 100% welcome any improvements as long as they make it the best guide possible

Part 1 of these guides is designed to help you in what is arguably the most important part of any HoN game: the first five minutes. By this I refer to the Drafting Stage, (Bans/Picks) choosing a lane, choosing starting items and generally just getting a good start to the game. A good first 5 minutes gives you a huge advantage over the other team, so let's see if you can pull it off.

THIS GUIDE IS STILL IN PROGRESS, However, I will save the thread intermittently for people who would like to read it as I write it.

Contents:Ctrl + F to find a particular part
1.Staring a Game/The Drafting Stage
1a. Tiers and Roles - What they mean and why they are important.
1b. Bans
1c. Picks
1d. Lanes/Courier/Wards

2. Heading into battle
2a. Items
2b. Warding and the illusive Bloodlust
2c. Skills

3. Conclusion

1. Starting a Game/The Drafting Stage
At the moment, the only real option for a competitive game mode is Banning Draft, in which picks/bans take the same procedure as Dota's -cm (1,2,2,2,2,1), but with a greatly reduced hero pool. In the next patch however, S2games are releasing "Banning Pick" which I can only assume will be the same as cm:

0.1.66 Test Patch! Jan 19
We are ready to put an early version of 0.1.66 on the test client. A lot of cool stuff is in this version including:
- Zephyr, Chronos, and Electrician reworks/changes
- Continued hero balance
- Vector Targetting
- New game mode - Banning Pick
- Nullstone tweaks
- Toggleable Offensive Auras
- Pyro can burn things!

OK, so you've hosted your 5v5 BD and you have your 5 in, I'm assuming you know the 5 you're playing with, because if you're playing with pubs and trying to use this guide you're not going to be very successful. This is where the game has already begun, and you should try to make steps to ensure a good start for your team.

• Nominate a Captain - Ever been in a pub where the initiator doesn't initiate and the team stands around hesitating before a gank? Just as in most other games, every team needs a Captain to take control of situations and let people know what to do, and since you're the one reading this guide, the Captain may as well be you. Not important until laning finishes and ganking/midgame begins, but when it does your responsibility is of paramount importance. Before ganks begin/when you get ganked, it is your responsibility to call out who to focus/who to protect/whether or not to chase et cetera. Every good team has a captain that can make competent calls and it is these that make or break most team encounters.
• Communicate - Another vital point to ensure before the game begins. A team without communication loses, no exceptions. This counts from the moment the countdown starts. Communicating properly during bans/picks is imperative to ensure your team skips down the path to victory. This continues on to the third and final point, which is
• Selflessness - Easily one of the most important qualities necessary for a team to win again and again. It's simple, you listen to the Captain. The Captain knows more than you, that's why he is the Captain. You really really really want to play Ophelia, go jungle shortlane jungle and leave magmus to solo long lane? Too bad it's a shit idea and you're shit for thinking of it. The team winning is more important than you getting kills/playing some shit hero you havent played in a while/trying some retarded strat. If the Captain wants you to play a certain hero because it is needed for the team (explained later) you will play it. Selflessness is also extremely important during the game itself (not killstealing, taking a death for the team) but I won't go into that.

1a. Tiers and Roles- What they mean and why they are so important
Here's how it breaks down, some heroes are better than others, some heroes are alot better than others. This is where tiers come in. Tiers basically seperate heroes into groups based on their utility in a 5v5 match, I won't scrutinise the tier list too much at this point as I will go into more detail in the Bans/Picks section, the point of this section is for you to familiarise yourself with the better heroes in the game. While they are not all there, and the exclusion of some and the inclusion of others is debatable, it is a good indication. Without further adieu, here is what I believe to be an accurate tier list. Please excuse if I make any mistakes or exclude any heroes accidentally, all I'm doing is copying the img location from the Heroes Database of HoN and I will probably miss a few, I'm very open to suggestions for changes to the tier list

High Tier



Another way in which heroes can be classified is Roles. Hero Roles don't so much classify heroes based on level of utility, but more their type of utility. Basically, there are two types of hero roles: Carry and Support. Their jobs are a lot like they sound: The carry carries the team to victory and the support(s) make sure the carry can. These two roles however are not exactly specific, so it is generally accepted that hero roles fall into these categories:

Hard Carry
These are heroes whose job it is to farm for a lot of early-mid game and come out lategame with dream items and win, basically. Usually hard carries suck early game but have a scaling steroid skill (attack speed boost, proc passive (bash) or just any skill that makes them incredibly hard to deal with the longer the game goes (sand wraith's dissipate)) The best hard carries are:


Semi-Carry
Just as Hard Carries own late game, Semi Carries and Gankers own mid/early game. Semi carries are the heroes that have more aggressive/ganking early game playstyle and can carry for a good portion of the game, but get severely outclassed in late game by real carries due to the lack of any proper late-game scalability. Semi carries have more ganking capabilities than Hard Carries, and as such should roam the map more in mid-early game to net a lot of kills. (Madman is an exception, he, like many s2 heroes is a touch broken. He is able to do well in early-mid game and still destroy late game as well as any hard carry, hence him being placed up there) The best semi-carries (I believe) are:


Ganker
Here's where it gets tricky. Ganker is kind of a broad term, Many (almost all) semi-carries can be considered gankers in that they have a stun or a slow or an aoe that can be used to clean up some kills in the early-mid stages. That said, there are some fine differences between a Semi-Carry, straight up Ganker and an Initiator. Semi Carries stay in the lane more as they need more farm than say, Witch Slayer for example (a ganker). To reiterate, a Ganker is a hero that can survive on little farm (is not item dependant) and has a powerful early game skillset that allows him/her to roam around the map early and gank heroes in lanes that need ganking/river/forest etc. Gankers however quickly lose effectiveness once the game progresses into mid/late game and there are a few shrunken heads on the enemy heroes. The heroes I believe to be the best gankers are:


Initiator
Gankers and Initiators are nearly completely the same group of heroes. The difference is however is that Initiators have the ability to begin a gank reliably. This mostly includes heroes with a large aoe disable who can execute their combo on the enemy team without getting interupted, usually with the help of a blink dagger, allowing for the other heroes to come in (ideally) and mop up the stunned heroes. The best initiators (there is almost no contest for this one) are:


Support
Support heroes are among the most underrated and underutilised heroes in the game - especially in pubs. Support heroes here refers to heroes that can make the carry's transition from a hellish early game to a hopefully adequately farmed midgame, by use of heals/defensive and offensive auras/courier and ward purchases and arguably most importantly - lane babysitting. Lane babysitting is essentially the lane pairup of a carry and a support hero, hereafter refered to as a babysitter. During the lane phase the sitter helps the carry to farm up by harassing the opposing lane and letting the carry take most if not all of the last hits. Great babysitters also have heals/stuns to make sure the carry doesn't get overly harassed. As the game progresses, it is the support's responsibility to consistently keep wards in the vital spots across the map (discussed later) and to purchase items that enable the rest of the team to maximise their killing potential. The best support heroes in my opinion are: (Demented Shaman and Plague Rider in particular are phenomenal support heroes in that they are two of the best babysitters, two of the best gankers and they can both farm very well)

Note that all four of my suggested support heroes are four of the best heroes in the game.

1b. Bans
Since the new Banning Pick mode is soon to become the dominant competitive mode of choice, I will explain bans with it in mind.
After the game is started, before each team can pick their heroes, both get to ban on a 1-2-2-1 scheme. For those of you who don't know, a 1-2-2-1 scheme is when Team 1 bans 1 hero, followed by Team 2 banning 2, Team 1 gets to then ban 2 again, and Team 2 gets the last ban, hence 1-2-2-1. The team who gets the first ban also gets the first pick. A competent team will formulate a lineup strategy based on the heroes and ban the heroes that could counter said lineup strategy. For example, if you are Team 1 with first ban, and you would like to use your first pick on Magebane (GLthere), you could ban Puppet Master: Magebane's strongest counter. A competent Team 2 however could see the Puppet Master first ban as you wanting to pick Magebane, and use their first ban on Magebane, and so on. I'm not going to go through every ban choice based on every lineup strategy/counterban conceivable, but you should get the idea. When not being used in the counter-to-my-lineup method, the first ban should never be used on the hero that you think is most likely to be banned, as it is likely that the other team will ban him, saving you a ban and possibly getting you first pick of the most powerful hero if they choose not to ban you. (This point is more pertinent in BD games where there are fewer powerhouses and they are far more valuable.) In conclusion:

• Ban to counter your opponents bans (They ban a counter to a great hero, you ban that hero)
• Ban to counter what you think could be your opponents' strategy based on their bans/their previous proficiency with certain heroes (Ban zeus if you're against Merlini)
• Ban a less powerful hero if the most powerful hero is available and you have first pick, forcing the other team to either waste a ban on him or give him to you.

A suggestion by geronimo for countering enemies with first pick

Something to possibly add in BD particularly - how to take advantage of 2nd pick. E.G. says there like 5 really good heroes in the draft. sandwraith jere plague archer tempest. Generally by the end 4 of those heroes will be banned, just without really thinking. A good idea is to do 2 dud bans such as electrician and pebbles. So the other team will probly ban like archer and plague so they can fp sandwraith. leaving 3 hereos ur really want. So you give them sandwraith and take the jere/tempest.

1c. Picks
Picks are in the same scheme as bans, except with 2 more 2s shoved in there (1-2-2-2-2-1 makes 10) As said before, a competent team will form a lineup strategy based on the heroes available, Let's assume bans have already happened so you know which heroes you can/cant pick. Because of the pick scheme, it's unlikely that you will be able to form the team you invisage when you first see the heroes, due to the opposing team picking the key heroes. However, most heroes have interchangeable counterparts so you should be able to form some sort of overall strategy in the picking stage. Popular strategies at the moment nearly all include a carry-sitter lane such as Shaman/Sandwraith or Nymph/Madman (Not as strong as it once was due to the recent nerfs) in the short lane, a solo mid semi carry such as Arachna, Corrupted Disciple or Blood Hunter and two strong ganky heroes at the long lane (Witch/Pharoah). Of course this is not the only valid method, you can try trilanes at bot (Pesti/Glacius/Witch is an MyM favourite) along with strong mid and top solos, a heavy gank lineup (Panda/Pebbles short, BH or Pharoah Mid, HB/Hammer long) or almost anything else you can think of. The point with strategies is to be creative, come up with something new that works, catch your opponents off guard so they can't pick to counter you.

Counterpicking your opponent is another method about which you can go in the picking stage. It is at this point that I will quote someone on HoN forums I can't remember the name of, who said something that is particularly perspicacious when it comes to picking in a -cm style game.

A: They got Rock, quick pick two papers! FUCK THEY GOT SCISSORS

This is a trap into which you do not want to fall. Because of the counter-mechanism that this scheme naturally sets up, countering on a pick by pick basis is usually not recommended (picking puppet and succubus to counter a magebane pick - probably not the best example because there's no saying puppet and succubus wouldnt perform well, but you get the idea) Instead, try to carefully analyse what your opponent is picking overall in order to deduce some sort of strategy from what they're picking. If, for example they pick Sand Wraith, Demented Shaman and Kraken, it's fairly obvious that their strategy for this game will revolve around a turtling defence that allows the game to stretch long and for sand wraith to farm. To counter this I would choose strong laners and pushers like Defiler/Torturer/Slither to finish the game up quickly or at least give you a strong enough early game that you can outfarm sand wraith. This is just one of many scenarios so try to come up with your own counters to certain situations. Because of the fact that you don't want to get counter picked yourself after they realise what you're doing, it's best to leave your counter picks until the last 2-3 picks, and pick just generally strong heroes from the God/Top tiers that suit you for your first 2. In conclusion

• Focus on the overall, not the individual. He may have picked Predator but you still need stuns.
• Be creative with hero strategies, If you can't get a good sitter/carry maybe it's best to switch it around and choose new heroes, they won't be expecting it.
• Throw as many spanners in as many works as possible, if they have a set strategy and you can figure it out, fuck it up.

1d. Lanes/Courier/Wards
OK, So you've finished the bans and you've got a team of heroes you think is synergetic enough to take out the win. Time for everyone to hit ready, right?
WRONG.
Before you hit ready, you need to use the 2 minutes you get after picking has finished to figure out the most vital elements of early game HoN, and those are Lanes, Courier and Wards.

Lanes
Lane partnerships have been pretty much covered already in the picks section, and you probably made your picks with lanes in mind. However, these still need to be sorted out before you get into the game. The configuration à la mode is to send your solo to mid to exploit runes, with two at top and bottom or one in the jungle instead of in top/bottom. I won't go through which heroes because you should've picked those already.

Courier

Before you start, you must decide who is buying a courier. Someone is buying a courier. No exceptions. A courier is on a par with wards as above and beyond the most value-for-money item in the game. The usual decision is to get the support/sitter to get it (the best courier hero arguably is nymphora as she doesnt need regen). However, if you're in a pinch for whatever reason (you shouldn't be) and the support can't get a courier, the hero who is the least item dependent should be getting it. I'm not even going to explain why a courier is necessary.

Wards

Much in the same vein as a courier, a set of wards is necessary to avoid nasty early game ganks that can really mess up the rest of your game. Same deal with wards, the support hero should buy them, if they're not comfortable with buying them straight up, get them to buy some on the courier once they farm 200g out in the lane. More about particular placement of the wards will be explained later.


2. Heading into Battle
This is the final element of my first guide. Here I explain what you need to do when starting to play the actual game.

2a. Items
The items you spend your first 603 gold on when heading into lane are specific to your role/what kind of early game you want to have. As mentioned before, the support heroes should be buying the wards and the courier, leaving ~400 gold left to be spent on various regeneration and stat items.

For all other heroes, the starting items can be a touch more flexible.

Regeneration

As a general rule, half of your startgame money (~300g) should be spent on regeneration. If in doubt, bring more regen. Going back to base to heal is a terrible move, and you should always ferry consumables to your hero with the courier. If the opponents have a strong early game lineup, it's best to bring enough regen to make sure you can stay in the lane getting xp/last hits.

Hatchet/Buckler

The majority of melee heroes should definitely get a hatchet, if not from the starting gold then when they farm 225 in a sidelane and get it from the outpost. Hatchets allow a far greater margin of error when going for last hits and denies, and makes the laning phase a lot easier for melee heroes. The exception to this is if (for example) you are playing a hero who will be playing a support/sitter role in the lane with a carry (Electrician for example) In this case, you should be letting the carry get the last hits and as such should spend the 225 gold elsewhere (stats/regen) to make the laning process easier for your carry. If you are having trouble with denies however, feel free to grab a hatchet from the side shop.
The second melee favourite is the iron buckler. Particularly favoured by melee agility heroes for its ability to be transformed into the Iron Shield with 2 slippers of agility purchased at the side shop, it helps the lane phase for melee heroes against more aggressive lane opponents. While not as essential as the Hatchet, the Iron Buckler does carve a core niche in particular heroes (Blood Hunter solo mid for example)

Stats

After regen/hatchet is purchased, it is best to fill the rest of your inventory with the most efficient form of stat boost possible. Early game stat increases give you a much needed boost of more hp, mana and damage (as well as negligible boosts to armour and mana regen). Minor totems are a staple of the early game build due to their unique position as the most cost efficient item in the game in terms of stats/cost. Pretenders crowns can be used if the space for totems is not available, but in most cases totems should be bought over crowns (with 200 gold left for example, 3 totems can buy +3 to every stat for 159g, while 1 Pretenders Crown can buy +2 to every stat for 185). Minor totems are made even more useful due to the recent introduction of the Mana Batter/Power Supply, enabling minor totems to have use in a common recipe once they have outlived their original usefullness.

Mana Battery

A possible selection for heroes who believe they will be up against heavy spell spammers in the laning phase (Armadon, Pharoah, Thunderbringer). However, while a valid choice to be the first item ferried out by the courier, the lack of any stat boost along with the relatively high cost (210) makes this a situational buy with the first 603 gold. Once they have farmed up 210 gold in a lane however, every hero should have one of these.

2b. Warding and the illusive Bloodlust
Foo has done a great warding guide to save me the trouble with screenshots, it can be found here: Heroes of Newerth: Warding Guide.
Typically, wards should go around the two runes (In spots suggested by the guide) to maintain vision of the river and the runes.
If you have 3 heroes with a damaging stun/good ganking move at level 1 (Hammer, Witch, Pyro) it is usually a good idea to congregate in hiding around the rune either at top or bottom and wait for someone from the other team to check the rune at 0:00. When they come, it's very easy to get a bloodlust with chain stuns. This puts you at a great early game advantage. If your team's short lane is having trouble with creep pulling (demonstrated further in guides to come), a pull ward is the norm for countering this, as neutral creeps will not respawn as long as vision is kept over where they spawn. Possible positioning is exemplified in the screenshot below.




2c. Skills
On a final note, an important thing to mention is that more often than not (excluding heroes with long skill cooldowns like Scout's ward and Tree's sight that need to be placed as soon as possible so to ensure maximum efficiency) it is best to leave your skills unranked until you get to the lane. This is because you never know when you'rer going to get ganked/going to need a skill you didnt think you would. I'm sure you've been in a game where a rune gank at 0:00 didn't end in a kill because Pharoah leveled his nuke before his mummies or something similar. When you think about it, there's no point to leveling your first skill point as soon as the game starts, so why not save it for when you actually need it?

3. Conclusion
Hopefully by reading this guide you have attained a greater level of understanding of the more intricate details of the first 5 minutes of the game and how they can give one team a great advantage over another. I will be making another guide in the near future that will explain more aspects of how the game itself is played (probably just how to play from start to finish). Thanks to everyone who has/is given/giving me feedback, I hope this guide can become the best it possibly can.

[Foo]

Anticipating to see how this guide is, it's definately something needed for quite a few of the GG HoN players, great to see you contributing instead of just bantering constantly in forums.

[jRdn]

good start

[geronimo]

should be interesting to read - "15minute mark when laning finishes and ganking/midgame begins" - I wouldnt advise telling people learning the game that they shouldnt be ganking before 15 minutes.

[FiveS]

should be interesting to read - "15minute mark when laning finishes and ganking/midgame begins" - I wouldnt advise telling people learning the game that they shouldnt be ganking before 15 minutes.

Roger, was just a minor approximation

[fuckwitBATTLECRAB]

is that it so far or is there a link to more?

[geronimo]

is that it so far or is there a link to more?

hes editing it as he goes i think

[fuckwitBATTLECRAB]

ahk sweet would be good to see when finished

[FiveS]

is that it so far or is there a link to more?

THIS GUIDE IS STILL IN PROGRESS, However, I will save the thread intermittently for people who would like to read it as I write it.

It'll be finished when everything outlined in the contents is written down.

[jamiec]

Decent read so far, keep it up. Hopefully some more guides to come

[stedytc]

i'd personally put tempest in godz

[FiveS]

i'd personally put tempest in godz

So would I 10 patches ago, along with magmus and other aoe superstars but the metagame has shifted away from the aoe bash that it was.

[Foo]

Would definately say DS belongs in God Tier without a doubt, and maybe SoulStealer/Vindicator in Top.

I would have to say that I also don't agree with Kraken/Hammerstorm in top tier as well. Disregard that though and it's looking great so far, good work

[fuckwitBATTLECRAB]

kraken is top tier very strong character if your good with him

[jamiec]

Yeah I was thinking of tempest, vindi and dazzle in god tier aswell. you can't win a battle if it's over before it's started. with a decent tempest/vindi player. Kraken definitely deserves top tier, one decent ulti can leave the other team dead or defending a racks with 2 people.

[deathdoG]

should be interesting to read - "15minute mark when laning finishes and ganking/midgame begins" - I wouldnt advise telling people learning the game that they shouldnt be ganking before 15 minutes.

Waiting for Todd's guide, because hes GOOD and actually a player that I respect unlike op.

[FiveS]

Yeah I was thinking of tempest, vindi and dazzle in god tier aswell. you can't win a battle if it's over before it's started. with a decent tempest/vindi player. Kraken definitely deserves top tier, one decent ulti can leave the other team dead or defending a racks with 2 people.

Yeah they all are top picks but God Tier is called God Tier for a reason. Tempest as I explained before is not as good as he used to be due to the metagame shifting away from AoEfest. Vindicator isn't as good as you think he is, he's definitely top tier but his cripplingly bad early-mid game makes him unable to rank with the likes of jere and behemoth. Dazzle is also a good one, if there was a rank in between God and Top he'd be in it. However, I think he's in a similar sort of idea as Jeraziah, just not as good. Also, I gave Kraken top tier. High = Top.

Waiting for Todd's guide, because hes GOOD and actually a player that I respect unlike op.

Mate, You've played two games with me. The first one I carried and we won. The second one I dced a few times and I couldn't help it. However I wasn't the reason we lost. We all played well and I'm happy that we did do so well against a team like geronimo's. You need to relax.

[FiveS]

Would definately say DS belongs in God Tier without a doubt, and maybe SoulStealer/Vindicator in Top.

I would have to say that I also don't agree with Kraken/Hammerstorm in top tier as well. Disregard that though and it's looking great so far, good work

I agree about Vindicator I must have missed him out when putting him in. Soulstealer's good and all but I don't think he's quite there because of how easy it is to shut him down. When I have a look at the tiers list again I'll take out hammerstorm and put Vindicator in. I'd say Hammer and Soul are at the same level as Valkyrie etc, never banned but picked a lot. The heroes I was trying to put into Top are heroes that I see get banned a lot, that's kind of how I based it.

EDIT: I also think I'll take predator out of top.

[deathdoG]

You carried a 3v3 against utter scrubs on Darkwood. Dc'ed a few times = dc'ed at the start of every team fight..? Anyone else on that team would back me on this, we had that game if only you WEREN'T playing.

I'm not saying you're a bad player, I just don't think you have the chops to write a thread on 'HoN general strategy'. Todd does, because hes a beast.

Bye bye.

[FiveS]

You're right. I suck you rock.

Bye bye

[_noside]

very good guide from a very respectable person. looking forward to the rest.

[Locky]

fives is a mate and knows his shit and is never wrong...

[FiveS]

fives is a mate and knows his shit and is never wrong...

Hahahahahaha

[SHo]

Now, I'm nowhere near the expertise of teedubbleyouGONNADIE or , Mike "GETAFUKNVANG" apex but I'm learning quite a bit and EVEN then, I wouldn't try to write a guide on the mechanics/fundamentals/basics of HoN. Go on ask me why I wouldn't.

Not only is it disrespectful to those who are actually good at the game, it's balls-to-the-wall arrogant.

I remember playing with dripskii and xsv one time, and outfragging most of your team with sparky. Not trying to boast, or even to make you look bad. But after that hilarious encounter, I would certainly take your opinion with a lake full of salt.

Good Luck with the guide.

[geronimo]

What you got so far is fine although i disagree alot with ur "god" tier and "high" tier, but its also pretty hard to say how a hero can be "high" tier in drafting when alot of time ur drafting to counter there picks etc. I personally would of just had "Firstpick/Ban worthy heroes" - and had like
Forsaken archer, tempest, jereziah, deadwood, demented shaman, plague rider, vindicator, pharoah, sand wraith, hellbringer.

Basically ur guaranteed to see these hereoes in the lineups or banned.

as for ur 2nd 3rd picks, theres really too many heroes to make a list out of and those picks are basically determined from wat u need to make ur lanes strong or to counter the other team. e.g. picking puppet master after theyve got magebane or a hero like pyro who counters accursed.

Its ur guide and i dont wanan sound like a fkwit trying to correct, but couldnt help myself when u have behemoth and magebane in a god tier with 3 heroes in it.

[FiveS]

Now, I'm nowhere near the expertise of teedubbleyouGONNADIE or , Mike "GETAFUKNVANG" apex but I'm learning quite a bit and EVEN then, I wouldn't try to write a guide on the mechanics/fundamentals/basics of HoN. Go on ask me why I wouldn't.

Not only is it disrespectful to those who are actually good at the game, it's balls-to-the-wall arrogant.

I remember playing with dripskii and xsv one time, and outfragging most of your team with sparky. Not trying to boast, or even to make you look bad. But after that hilarious encounter, I would certainly take your opinion with a lake full of salt.

Good Luck with the guide.

I fail to see how making a guide is arrogant. As I said I am not claiming to hold a monopoly on knowledge of how HoN works, I am open to feedback and am just trying to make the most informative and thorough guides possible to help the people who need to know.
If you think I've made a mistake or would like to give me some feedback in my guide you are welcome to, as far as you thinking I'm a bad player based on a game I can't remember with a team of friends I have that used to be piss poor awful and that somehow negatively affecting the quality of a guide that I am openly allowing to be critiqued and remedied, well that's neither here nor there really is it.

What you got so far is fine although i disagree alot with ur "god" tier and "high" tier, but its also pretty hard to say how a hero can be "high" tier in drafting when alot of time ur drafting to counter there picks etc. I personally would of just had "Firstpick/Ban worthy heroes" - and had like
Forsaken archer, tempest, jereziah, deadwood, demented shaman, plague rider, vindicator, pharoah, sand wraith, hellbringer.

Basically ur guaranteed to see these hereoes in the lineups or banned.

as for ur 2nd 3rd picks, theres really too many heroes to make a list out of and those picks are basically determined from wat u need to make ur lanes strong or to counter the other team. e.g. picking puppet master after theyve got magebane or a hero like pyro who counters accursed.

Its ur guide and i dont wanan sound like a fkwit trying to correct, but couldnt help myself when u have behemoth and magebane in a god tier with 3 heroes in it.

I haven't gotten to who to pick/ban yet, I'm just outlining the heroes in tiers as is the method du jour on the hon forums. I understand where you disagree but I haven't yet gotten to the part where I explain how to pick/ban to counter the other teams picks/bans. As for the god tier, I am confident in saying that Behemoth Magebane and Jeraziah are at the moment the 3 best heroes in the game, and that's why they're up there. To reiterate, I am well aware of how picks/counterpicks and bans/counterbans work, and rest assured they will be mentioned in great detail, This guide is nowhere near finished. I again stress that I'm not married to every idea I write down, anything and everything is liquid and if I get a better offer as to what to put there I'll include it.

EDIT:

Its ur guide and i dont wanan sound like a fkwit trying to correct,

It's not my guide, please try to correct as much as possible, I'm not doing this for an ego trip or to be zealously overprotective of my ideas, I'm doing it so there can be a decent guide that people can learn and develop from so there becomes less of an enormous skill gulf between the good and the bad.

[stedytc]

ahh yes pharaoh, gZuZ ganker. Put ophelia and hag up for ganker as well.

[FiveS]

ahh yes pharaoh, gZuZ ganker. Put ophelia and hag up for ganker as well.

Haha I can't put all of them up I'm limiting myself to what I believe to be 4 of the best for each role, I'm fairly sure I'm going to run into some sort of image limit soon.

[jamiec]

Will you be doing guides to effective jungling, stacking, lane pulling, etc?

Also most heroes that can jungle from level 1 are effective gankers early game correct? eg; ophelia, lycan, legionaire, tempest, etc etc

[FiveS]

Picking section is up, since Pick/Ban strategies are probably the most debatable of the entire guide I again ask for feedback and constructive criticism

@jamiec - We'll see how I feel about jungling guides, since they've been done to death I may just quote a particularly good one on the HoN forums, as jungling/stacking is not my area of expertise.

Creep Pulling/Warding creep spots will definitely get a mention however. Warding creep spots will probably get a mention in this guide

[stedytc]

jungling is good but if you dont do it correctly, you can reaaaallly fuck yourself up.

[FiveS]

jungling is good but if you dont do it correctly, you can reaaaallly fuck yourself up.

Give the ban/pick section a read and tell me what you think

[_noside]

Now, I'm nowhere near the expertise of teedubbleyouGONNADIE or , Mike "GETAFUKNVANG" apex but I'm learning quite a bit and EVEN then, I wouldn't try to write a guide on the mechanics/fundamentals/basics of HoN. Go on ask me why I wouldn't.

Not only is it disrespectful to those who are actually good at the game, it's balls-to-the-wall arrogant.

I remember playing with dripskii and xsv one time, and outfragging most of your team with sparky. Not trying to boast, or even to make you look bad. But after that hilarious encounter, I would certainly take your opinion with a lake full of salt.

Good Luck with the guide.

I don't see how voluntarily posting a guide intended to help other people is arrogant and disrespectful. FiveS is a decent hon player, but in team games usually people are only as good as their worst player. Also different variables could have played a part in your lucky win against their team aswell as dripskii getting hit by a car.

[Foo]

Ban zeus if you're against Merlini

I lold, Merlini was my DotA idol, obviously coinciding with Zeus being my favourite DotA hero.

[silent]

Nice guide so far, all the people hating, honestly stfu. If you want to present something that counters what the OP says then do it in a reasonable way.

[jamiec]

I seen tmc the jump off the cock mate, nice edit silent xD

[geronimo]

Something to possibly add in BD particularly - how to take advantage of 2nd pick. E.G. says there like 5 really good heroes in the draft. sandwraith jere plague archer tempest. Generally by the end 4 of those heroes will be banned, just without really thinking. A good idea is to do 2 dud bans such as electrician and pebbles. So the other team will probly ban like archer and plague so they can fp sandwraith. leaving 3 hereos ur really want. So you give them sandwraith and take the jere/tempest. Sounds pretty simple, but im sure its a banning strat noone really ever thinks about. :

[SPUNJ]

THATS A GREAT IDEA TODD, YOU HAVE OPENED MY MIND - AND IM SURE MANY OTHERS TO THIS AMAZING PICKING STRAT

[FiveS]

Something to possibly add in BD particularly - how to take advantage of 2nd pick. E.G. says there like 5 really good heroes in the draft. sandwraith jere plague archer tempest. Generally by the end 4 of those heroes will be banned, just without really thinking. A good idea is to do 2 dud bans such as electrician and pebbles. So the other team will probly ban like archer and plague so they can fp sandwraith. leaving 3 hereos ur really want. So you give them sandwraith and take the jere/tempest. Sounds pretty simple, but im sure its a banning strat noone really ever thinks about. :

I put something in there like that but not as specific, thanks for the input I'll put it in.

Going to bed now will add the finishing touches tomorrow, still a few hundred words to go.

If anyone would like to read the section on picks and give me feedbacks/point out some mistakes it'd be greatly appreciated.

[11411181]

You've formatted the text to always be black or something so you have to highlight it on the dark skin to read it. From about 1c down.

I'd put Deadwood as god-tier, he's ridiculously good for a melee solo with uproot and a hatchet as well as having a version of kunkka's stun/waterfall thing and the ol1puNch. Creep AI changes in regards to the tug-of-war etc. have hurt this a little, but not enough to put him any lower imo. IMO.

You _could_ add in that gankers like pebbles etc. help their team the most by keeping the other team's carry/heroes levels (and farm) down while keeping the heat off the ones on your team who do need to farm/level hard. I've always found this generalization to be true whenever playing or watching honcast matches etc.
This would help separate the slight gap in your definition, since it doesnt seem all that clear why you'd choose a "hero that needs to farm to kill" over "hero that doesn't need to". Why pick a character like dark lady, when you can pick pebbles and run around 2shotting people?