GG MW2 S&D Ladder Ruleset - Discussion

[Twilife]

We're all pretty settled in and used to the rules we use on CG, which we believe is a very solid ruleset. However we're willing to hold a quick, open discussion to accumulate any ideas people may have that may make the ruleset that little bit more 'Pro'. These changes will most likely be rather minute. Changes may not even occur at all.

I've gone and highlighted (bold) the key reasonable aspects I've seen discussed on both websites that some people have been interested in altering. Please feel free to discuss the below issues which are in bold.

Please do not suggest Perks Enabled, or any Health or Health Regeneration settings as these have already been debated upon and decided. Also, do not suggest 'a different gametype' - we'll get to the 4v4 one soon.

GG MW2 5v5 S&D Ladder Ruleset
Settings:
Round length: 2.5 minutes
Bomb timer: 45 seconds
Plant time: 5/7.5 seconds
Defuse time: 5/7.5 seconds
Multi bomb: Disabled
Score limit: Unlimited
Round switch: Never

Team Options:
Spectator Mode: Team Only
Wave spawn delay: None
Force re-spawn: Enabled
Radar always: No
Friendly Fire: Enabled

Player Options:
Number of lives: 1 life
Re-spawn delay: None
Max Health: Half
Health Regeneration: Slow
Allow Kill-cam: Disabled

Game play Options:
Head shots only: Disabled
Perks: Disabled
Killstreak Rewards: Disabled
Hardcore mode: Enabled/Disabled
3rd Person: Disabled

Banned Weaponry (Primary):
Assault Rifles: ACR & M4A1
Sub Machine Guns: UMP45, P90 & Vector
Light Machine Guns: All Banned
Sniper Rifles: Barret .50cal, WA2000 & M21 EBR
Riot Shield is Banned

Banned Weaponry (Secondary):
Machine Pistols: All Banned
Shotguns: All Banned
Handguns: .44 Magnum
Launchers: All Banned

Banned Equipment:
Tactical Insertion
Blast Shield
Claymore
C4

Special Grenade:
Stun Grenades Banned

Perks:
All Perks are Disabled

Deathstreak:
Painkiller, Martyrdom & Final Stand are Banned
Copycat is the only Deathstreak any player is allowed to use

Banned Weapon Attachments (Primary and Secondary):
Grenade Launcher, Shotgun, Heartbeat Sensor, Thermal Scope, Akimbo & Extended Mags

Maps:
Afghan
Favela
Invasion
Karachi
Quarry
Skidrow
Sub Base
Terminal

Don't take the bolds as "This is what we've decided, what do you think?" - they're just debatable suggestions we've heard roaming round the COD-corridors.

Maps are also an important issue as glitches have been found on two important maps in Skidrow and Terminal. These glitches aren't entirely obvious so they may be hard to police and could potentially ruin gameplay. Thoughts?


Thanks.


PS: This will not end up in another poll.

Dazed / Duke / Twilife

[THE DECEPTIC0NS]

5 second plant and defuse is the way of the future might as well get on with it. I'd like to see hud on if only for the start of the season.

The weapon bans look good too, drop the magnum. Not sure about the AR's. If ur gonna drop those 2 then scar should follow. IMO just drop the acr as m4 still has some recoil.

The problem with banning these assault rifles is it is pretty much guaranteeing everyone will be using famas or m16 which would make things a bit boring.

Maps are fine maybe drop skid row cos its garbage.

[Sandz]

IMO Keep the vector, it is accurate but it is extremely week and has a high fire rate with a small clip. Also i would like to see the HUD on.

i know the Glitch on Terminal, but whats the one on Skidrow?
we can't take out to many maps because it will just be boring. We also need to remember that in March - April a DLC is comming out, with new maps

[Twilife]

SCAR shouldn't follow the ACR and M4. It has a 20 bullet clip and bounces around a fair bit. Way I see it, M4 and the ACR are the only AR's without con's. They're a tid-bit weaker but that doesn't really matter with half health - everything is pretty strong. AK recoils heaps, TAR recoils + dodgy iron sight + bad RDS, F2000 is rather woeful, SCAR short clip n recoil, FAMAS is burst, M16 is burst, FAL is single shot.

Dunno about the Vector, I've seen it do some ridiculous stuff (that of UMP-quality) and then I've seen it be woeful.

Am I correct in saying that with COD4 you had (m16) 30 bullets in your current clip, then an additional 90 - whereas MW2 you get 30 + additional 60?

[Mattt.]

Banning the Vector will force people to mainly use an MP5 and some with an Uzi

[Dazed]

Originally Posted by Mattt.

Banning the Vector will force people to mainly use an MP5 and some with an Uzi

Both of which require the most skill to use effectively than any of the other smgs.

[DejaVuw]

Originally Posted by Twilife

SCAR shouldn't follow the ACR and M4. It has a 20 bullet clip and bounces around a fair bit. Way I see it, M4 and the ACR are the only AR's without con's. They're a tid-bit weaker but that doesn't really matter with half health - everything is pretty strong. AK recoils heaps, TAR recoils + dodgy iron sight + bad RDS, F2000 is rather woeful, SCAR short clip n recoil, FAMAS is burst, M16 is burst, FAL is single shot.

Dunno about the Vector, I've seen it do some ridiculous stuff (that of UMP-quality) and then I've seen it be woeful.

Am I correct in saying that with COD4 you had (m16) 30 bullets in your current clip, then an additional 90 - whereas MW2 you get 30 + additional 60?

Yeh I noticed that Twi, You don't get as many clips in MW2.

[Twilife]

Could be grounds to leave a v. good handgun in, i.e. .44 magnum

[Dazed]

Magnum takes ages to reload so i think that makes it less "overpowered" in a way but i dunno..

[RaptuRe.]

Bomb Plant/Defuse: 5 Seconds!

ACR banned.

[Buzzin]

7.5 plant & defuse. ACR banned.

I dont use the M4A1 but theres really no reason to ban as not many people use it & i dont think its that overpowered.
All Eu rules etc. are 5seconds plant & defuse on demolition only.
Search & destroy is still 7.5.
Magnum shouldnt be banned-takes a while to reload compared to USP and other pistols.

[Fray Woodzy]

I use the acr from time to time but only in a situation where its mid to short range. Long range u will continually get outshot by sum1 with an m16/famas.

All AR's should stay because as is 80% of people who use them run the m16/famas so i dont see it being a problem because m4 and acr arnt whored.

Magnum going could be a good thing because the desert eagle requires ALOT of skill to be used effectivly whereas the magnum just falls straight back into place after every shot. But that is debateable.

Plant difuse could change to 5 but i quite like the extra time it takes etc but either way.

I dont like the idea of hud just yet, Having no hud makes the game that much more intense and when the bomb is down u have to play by ur instincts. Which is good.

Hud and AR's are the only things i deff wouldnt change from cg rules. Plant and difuse could and same with magnum.

Also keep vector adds variety

[Dazed]

Plant 5sec defuse 7.5

[Buzzin]

I wouldnt mind that actually Dazed but it might make attack more easy. That 2.5 seconds can make alot of difference.

[Twilife]

Most maps (all maps?) are defence-advantaged. 5sec plant acts as a reward for getting to a bombsite, 7.5 sec is a punishment for letting a team get there.

Other arguments to that, if it's 7.5 defuse the attacker who planted can get very far away. Once they hear the defuse sound they have more-than-ample time to get back to check the bomb

[PodX12]

only thing i dnt like is afagan as a map its very bad i use mp5 as does a fair few other ppl mp5 is better than vector imo and the subbys are balanced as they are as for ARs the ACR is fine its not whore at all. because its not over powered its weak as as soon as u try n shoot throw a wall it does nothing and tags heaps...magnum is arguable...desert eagle has more recoil but relodes quicker same as the other larger clip pistols.

IMO only thing i dnt like is afgan

[iCrew X HypeR]

Banned Weaponry (Primary):
Sub Machine Guns: UMP45, P90. I think the Vector should stay, i just used it in a pug, it's fairly inaccurate with low damage but high fire rate and small clip.

Handguns: .44 Magnum should stay because it only has a 6 round clip.

Maps:
Skidrow this map is horrid, very one sided due to only a few ways to get to the bomb and very easy to lock down.

Just my thoughts.

Also maybe 5 second plant defuse might be a good idea so people can't just wait for the sound and count for a few seconds to check if it was a fakie.

[Dazed]

Originally Posted by iCrew X HypeR

Maps:
Skidrow this map is horrid, very one sided due to only a few ways to get to the bomb and very easy to lock down.

I disagree entirely with that one.. Skidrow isnt bad it all, it really takes skill to get enough rounds on attack to win. I played my frist proper clan match on it last night and it wasnt that easy to defend and in the end the score ended up at 14-10.

[PsYch0ticAu55ie]

5 plant 7.5 defuse

Get rid of afghan

And not really sure about the magnum, havent really tried out the deagle enough

[RaptuRe.]

With a 5 second plant, you'll find that you will have to be watching the bomb very closely or someone could easily sneak in. It will end up balancing and bring A/D to the same level.

We can try 5 seconds plant/defuse for the 'pre-season' and if we don't like it. It can be adjusted for round robin.

Originally Posted by PsYch0ticAu55ie

Get rid of afghan

[zzzzz]

If we keep afghan and have a 5 second plant it would push the map to being a bigger attack advantage, even with nades and flashes coming into defence spawn.

[xX iC3M4N]

i agree bout afghan dunno y its even in the map choices on CG get rid of it.

dnt get rid of the magnum theres no point its only a pistol the deagle in cod4 is basically the exact same.

As for the AR's i personally think the ACR and M4 should be gone but idk people dont seem to use them that much anyway i still think there cheap guns tho

[Twilife]

Yeah, I don't think anyone ever chooses to play Afghan on CG. Odd choice indeed.

Magnum is basically a super version of the COD4 deagle in regards to shooting, but with slower reload and 1 less bullet. COD4 deagle actually had effective recoil. Pistols seem to have become a bit more important, at least that I've noticed. You get less ammo for your primary gun to start off with.

I don't think the game will change all that much with 5 sec plant. I think if we went with 5second defuse, it'd change rather drastically though and unfortunately give even more advantage to the defenders.

[its the gmoney]

5 sec plant/7.5 defuse sounds good.

If we were wanting to make this a purely skill based competition, taking away the m4 and ACR would be a good idea.

The ACR takes the least amount of skill to use, with the carbine coming a close second (in the rifle department).

But seriously, IMO, the vector has to go.
No skill to use. Little to no kick back and deadly accurate off hip long range.
Mp5K takes much more skill to use.

But this is primarily for a skill based competition not necessarily fun.

I say this as the primary argument for people is that the skill gap is too small, to try and increase the skill gap, banning easy guns is the best way.

[~kritikal]

I have to dissagree with that, with the banning of the ACR and M4 barely anything will change. This game is dominated by famas players/people who can't use anything other than the famas.

The vector does have minimal recoil but in many situations the mp5 is a better gun.

The skill gap in this game will not be fixed by removing guns. It's pretty unfixable.

Trial the plant times. Should of always been 5 seconds in my opinion.

[budgey]

hud off fo sure back over the same ground

[Twilife]

Honestly expected an essay Budge

[I xLoGiKx I]

tbh, I hate it when the bomb has been planted and you are defending. I keep checking to see the time but it's not there. That would be the only reason why hud should be on.

[budgey]

same ground again. what should it matter about knowing the exact time. u know u got 45secs with which to do ur shit so do it.5v1 u know its an uphill battle to clutch, I literally wince with pain when I hear "if i knew the time i would've won that" U got a fair idea aswell if ur defending. I have no worries at all and enjoy the challenge of not knowing. Its almost the same as saying "oh shit I didnt know I was the last one" because u were last one alive and got killed. so wat if ur not the last one ur not gonna walk out there and commit suicide because the rest of ur team is alive. I dont think so, we're not retarded are we? shittest reason just to have hud on.

[moor3y]

Rules as is imo.

Subbase, Afgan - OUT!

Skidrow rules yo?

Vector is crazy hard at distance so in most situations you will lose anyway, keep it

Scar might have a small clip and might bounce but so does the AK and the M4 if you remove the M4 and ACR take out the scar aswell for good measure.

[Twilife]

None of them have a small clip like the SCAR though.

[zzzzz]

Keep the AR's it brings versatile into play, as well as i rarely see anyone using the ACR, m4 or scar in matches.

[Twilife]

I do rarely see the ACR or M4 but I whore the shit out of the SCAR for spray points :P

[zzzzz]

Banned.

[Dazed]

Its not really a matter of whether people whore them or not, if u ban them then they're not there to be whored in the event that a player or team decides to do so.

GG is the elite competition where the most skill is required to win, therefore banning weapons and limiting options to a more even field brings the decision down to skill, not who used what weapon and such.

[antiX shano]

dazed bringing in the pc plant times :P i would agree with that but its way better imo, afgan get rid of it please. and keep the 44 magnum only 6 bullets in the clip and slow reload compared to the usp or m9 which have 12 bullets or more in the clip and faster reload

[Fez]

I believe the Vector should be allowed, I have seen it do some very good things, but then I've seen it do some very bad things, and when I think back, you remember the people you were playing against and they are normally quality players with good shots. I don't really see the big thing about the AR's I don't mind if their in or out. I don't really use an ACR or M4 unless I want an automatic and I normally hit the Tar 21 up before them anyway. I think I like the idea of 5 second plant and 7.5 defuse. Be a nice change of pace anyway.

Magnum should be allowed I rekon but if its not ill hit the Desert Eagle up like I did on Cod4 anyway.

I believe the maps listed are fine. Skidrow should definately be allowed, I for one don't know the glitch and if it is a major thing I am willing to see it go, but it is actually a hard map to play. I'm sure Insurgency will back me on this, but it is actually really hard to keep the game in your hands if you drop rounds on attack. And it is also not easy to hold defence as their are a lot of critical positions on the map. Eg, Boxes, Tunnel, B Alley, Bottom Mid. 1 Player goes down and you have a gap and this is what makes the defence have problems as sliding a defence is a skill on its own on this map.

I don't mind if terminal goes, I don't really like it and I believe the glitch is rather annoying and I hate it being used against me.

[iironik]

vector doms to hard at close range and is still decent at long has to go
only assault that worry's me is the acr deadly accurate no recoil
as for the magnum leave it doesnt seem that op and reloading takes ages

[I xLoGiKx I]

magnum not overpowered yet it's 1 bullet most of the time.

[Fray Woodzy]

Maps: afgan goes thats it. Should keep sub base as for those who havent played i suggest you should try it. Has prob the best layout out of all the SnD maps and i believe its a "cod 4" type of map. As in it actually is good to play search on.

Guns: Keep all AR's, i dont see the point of getting rid of acr and m4 because mayb 1 person each match uses it. We dont wanna completly eliminate every gun that we think is "too easy to use" as if we are basing it on that philosophy then m16 and famas would go first as they are the easiest guns to use.

Vector i dont really care whether it goes or not but close range it is rediculously good and this gun gets whored on some maps that are very compact because the gun is useable at mid range aswell.

Leave all handguns because people will complain about how inacurate the deagle is even though thats the only pistol i like

Plant times/hud: Change plant time to 5 and keep difuse at 7.5 and leave hud off.